Ok. This category has long time inactive, and it is supposed to be one of the more important in this Church. So, I'm comming with something to think and discuss about.

We know quite well what Bible says about homosexuality after having studied the "clobber passages" and clarified the meaning of the bugging words (malakoi, arsenokoitai, etc.)

But here, I'm thinking about some different approach: What Bible does say about some relationships that are, in the best of the cases, "suspicious". And I'm thinking in the Ruth-Naomi couple, David-Jonathan or the centurion-slave's affair (among others).

So, what do you think if we can spend some of our gray matter discussing about this issue? Of course we may do it one at a time.

Blessings!

Brakhus, this is a very interesting idea! Thank you.

I've always admired Ruth and Naomi. I don't think the scriptures are clear about their relationship. But as I read their story, I picture them together, caring and tending to each other's needs. Ruth risked her life to follow Naomi but did it with such passion.

"But Ruth replied, "Don't ask me to leave you and turn back. I will go wherever you go and live wherever you live. Your people will be my people, and your God will be my God. I will die where you die and will be buried there. May the LORD punish me severely if I allow anything but death to separate us!" (Ruth 1:16&17)

Naomi knew how important it was for Ruth to have a husband but how difficult it would be for her to find one on her own. In those times, she would have been left a beggar if she had no husband. "One day Naomi said to Ruth, "My daughter, it's time that I found a permanent home for you, so that you will be provided for." (Ruth 3:1) How hard it must have been for Naomi to send her away to marry a man but how necessary!

As I read through the book of Ruth, I could not find one word that suggested they were a couple...but I could not find one word that suggested they were not. What do others think?

I think Ruth was a str8 woman and a very honorable woman at that! Naomi was her mother in-law, that's about it. Ruth was married to Naomis son. I would hesitate to interject anything beyond loyalty in the case of Ruth and Naomi!!!

As far as hard to send her to marry a man, Boaz was also a very honorable man and Naomi was thrilled that her daughter in law was graced by the Lord to find favor in his sight. Naomi would have sent Ruth nowhere! Boaz would have taken her in as family! Ruths Faithfullness brought her into the direct family line of Jesus!!!


RUTH 4 (AMPLIFIED BIBLE)

13 So Boaz took Ruth and she became his wife. And he went in to her, and the Lord caused her to conceive, and she bore a son.

14 And the women said to Naomi, Blessed be the Lord, Who has not left you this day without a close kinsman, and may his name be famous in Israel.

15 And may he be to you a restorer of life and a nourisher and supporter in your old age, for your daughter-in-law who loves you, who is better to you than seven sons, has borne him.

16 Then Naomi took the child and laid him in her bosom and became his nurse.

17 And her neighbor women gave him a name, saying, A son is born to Naomi. They named him Obed. He was the father of Jesse, the father of David [the ancestor of Jesus Christ].

Good thoughts, Rose. Both of our perspectives are quite possible and your perspective may be more right than mine.

I think most importantly, in addition to learning how Ruth fits into the line of Jesus, the book of Ruth teaches us life lessons. It gives us a great example of how we should take care of each other. Whether they were a couple or not was irrelevant to the lessons we needed to learn from them and so that detail was left out. I look forward to meeting them both in heaven some day...I guess it will be then that we know!

What do others think about this couple or other couples?

I'm agreeing with Rose on the Ruth-Naomi story. I think it's a classic m-i-l, d-i-l relationship among straight women except they actually cared for each other & got along (which isn't always the case!) I think it's a story about love & about LOYALTY...

What a wonderful posts!

Let me put my part on this now. I started the topic thinking about this: Gay christian people are so concerned about what Bible does say or doesn't about homosexuality, that we have the peril to push the line. One thing is to understand that Bible doesn't condemn homosexuality and other quite different is to find passages that supposely affirm homosexuality. Which passages are possibly affirming? Let's see along our discussion.

In the case of Ruth and Naomi is perfectly clear (for me, at least) their love for each other, their loyalty, the mutual support and consolation. I think that there is not any doubt about love and friendship beyond they were in laws relatives. They were so loving to each other and their love was so important that Bible remarks it specially.

But, were they a lesbian couple? I cannot say it, because there is not any metion about some sexual connotation in their relationship. And we may accept that a lesbian couple requires, at least, sexual attraction though doesn't require, necessarily, sexual "activities".

When some people invoke the Ruth-Naomi's relationship to base their arguments, they are (inconsciously, at least) looking for bases to affirm the sexual part of the homosexuality issue. And what about love and loyalty? In one hand, they could take it for given; but in the other hand, the sexual part could be (for them) more important and so, love, loyalty and mutual support are (for them, again) just secondary aspects.

Finally, I think that the lesson we can learn about the story of Ruth and Naomi, is about love, loyalty and mutual support (no matter if these three aspects are present in a same sex relationship as well). And in addition, if they were sexually engaged it was not important, the only important issue was, precisely, LOVE, LOYALTY AND MUTUAL SUPPORT. Wasn't it?

Blessings!

P.S.: I'm getting better in my slang's learning: m-i-l (mother in law?) and d-i-l (daughter in law?) Is it right, DewDoc?

Hey, I'm proud of you, Brakhus! m-i-l & d-i-l, exactly!

quote:

Finally, I think that the lesson we can learn about the story of Ruth and Naomi, is about love, loyalty and mutual support (no matter if these three aspects are present in a same sex relationship as well). And in addition, if they were sexually engaged it was not important, the only important issue was, precisely, LOVE, LOYALTY AND MUTUAL SUPPORT. Wasn't it?

Well put, kind of describes marriage doesn't it? It's so ironic that the Christian 'far right' fights so hard against same sex marriage only to use as their marriage vows words spoken by one woman to another. God must get a good chuckle at our silliness sometimes.