Ok, here's a discussion I'd like to throw out..

When you're praying for an answer to something, how many times have you asked God to give you some kind of sign? More importantly, how many times have you said something to the effect of: "I'll know this is Your will Lord, if such & such happens." Or "If a certain thing happens, then that'll be a sign of Your approval and if it doesn't then I'll know You don't approve."
Then later on you see "the sign" and feel you have God's answer, or you don't see it, and feel the answer was "no" or vice versa.

My point is, are we really getting a sign from God when we pray that way? I'm just curious because I decided to pray about something a while ago and also ask for some kind of sign from God. But I wanted to be absolutely sure I was really hearing from God, so I prayed for a specific thing to happen if the answer was 'yes', and another specific thing to happen if the answer was 'no'. Well needless to say, neither thing happened. Obviously God's not talking to me at the moment, but it made me wonder how many times we assume we've heard from God, when we haven't.

I have prayed for a fleece to happen, so I would know for sure about something I was straddling the fence on. I did get the answer, exactly as I wanted it to happen, lol, only it was not the answer I wanted. But I just reminded God that it happened in the Old Word, it can still happen today, and I need it.

Now on certain other things, I still have yet to get the billboard answer.

I would rather think that God has given us a mind and ability to think so that we would be able to decide the best choice in different situations. So I would not really ask for any signs, or think that it would be the right way to proceed about choices. I don't think that there would be only one choice in many things, except in moral choices. I mean that something is morally right or wrong. But not that one choice of a place to live, a job to take, a person to marry would be any more "right" than another. Of course God knows what choice we are making, and he sometimes closes the door completely on some choices so that it's impossible to do something.

But we can always pray for wisdom in all the choices we need to make. Yet I would think that the "rightness" and "wrongness" of my choice has a lot to do with my maturity at the time.

I suppose my ideas about the subject are very well summed up in Gary Friesen's excellent book "Decision making and the will of God".

This message has been edited. Last edited by: Bluewings,

Aaaah yes! Let's say someone prays for a sign about whether or not being gay is right or wrong. They pray something like, "If being gay is a sin in your eyes Lord, then tomorrow my old friend Corey will call, and that'll be a sign that I'm living in sin."
Well Corey doesn't call, so I think I have God's approval. Meanwhile someone else prays that God will have an old friend call as a sign that it's okay to be gay. The friend doesn't call, and she believes God has let her know being gay is a sin. Now, for the radical part- how many people pray things like this and are then convinced the Lord has spoken to them and they tell everyone they know that God has spoken to them and they know in their heart this or that is God's will, because God gave them a sign?
I've heard stories like this from different people, and in truth I wonder why God wouldn't answer a prayer like that if the person sincerely desired to know God's will.
(I'm still wondering why He didn't answer me about what I was unsure of.)

I wonder how many people think they know God's will, by praying in such a way that no matter what, they will get an answer and then presume to speak for God, when He hasn't said a word or a cast a sign.

Just something for all of us to think about..

Good question.

Never prayed for that myself. But I can imagine people doing that.
I did pray about buying a house, if it was for me, this certain thing would come about, that was so outlandish...and it did, so I bought my house.

Pyro,

Even though I have prayed for direction at times and know I receieved a specific answer, I find as I grow up in the Lord that His Word has all the answers. I think when we are very young in the Lord He sometimes speaks to us more specifically, to build our Faith, but expects us to depend on the direction He already laid out for the whole Body through the Scriptures.

His whole Word keeps telling us to study and to search the Scriptures. I wonder why I've needed a sign when I've already been given His direction through the Bible. Maybe because it's more work to pick it up and study it daily. But the Scriptures teach it is able to make one Wise. Jesus Himself said that people are always seeking a sign, but He didn't at all sound like He was encouraging people to do that.

HIS GRACE AND PEACE,
ROSE

This message has been edited. Last edited by: <Rose>,

Pyro,
I, too, have prayed for signs. Never got one. I think looking for a specific sign is putting our will before God's. However, there are always signs around if you look for them, in God's word and in the world, signs that God wants the best for us, and signs that point the way for us. I have written before about how I found my current church. I was struggling with my faith and going through a rough time. A scripture came to my mind, and peace came with it. Then I went to a funeral, and that scripture turned out to be the founding one for that congregation. Signs like that give peace and a sense of things fitting together right. Hope this means something to you.
Ingrid

I don't think asking God for a sign is necessarily putting our will before God's, if you're asking Him what His will is about something.
It's more a matter of praying in such a way that will cause you to read too much into something that may be be completely circumstantial.

On a more humorous note related to this subject,
I read a clip last year in the newspaper, under "News of the Weird" about a guy that asked God to prove He was there.
(Something to the effect of, "God if you're there, prove it!" )
I guess it could've been pure coincidence, but I find it unlikely..
he was struck by lightning.

We know God can certainly give a sign if He chooses. Why, when or whom He chooses to give a sign to is up to Him. Why we don't get one when we feel we need one is frustrating. But like everything else, perhaps there's a reason why God chooses to remain silent at times. I know I'd even settle for a, "Your prayer has been heard and duly noted, however you're not ready for My answer at this time, so just be patient and I'll get back to you when you are."

LOL--I like that voicemail message, Pyro! I understand your frustration. Heck, I share your frustration! Wouldn't it be nice if God simply put up a billboard somewhere that said, "Hey, THIS issue is o.k. with Me. THIS OTHER ONE isn't o.k. with Me." I understand what Rose is saying, that that's what the Bible is supposed to be for us. But I also understand that when sincere & good-hearted people interpret the Bible differently, it causes so many difficulties for us all. I'm a perfect example of this. I'm not gay myself. I was raised in a very conservative Baptist church. Yet I have so many very close gay friends & I ache for them when they're having problems with family members who are convinced their interpretations of the Bible are absolutely correct & that being gay is a sin. I would love to be able to stand up & say absolutely, unequivocably that the Bible doesn't say that! But I can't. I can only say, "IN MY OPINION, MY INTERPRETATION AFTER MUCH PRAYER is........." Now there must be a reason God does this but there are days I get very frustrated about it! Is it so we'll work harder on our own compassion? Is it so we won't be too smug about being "right" when we aren't totally sure we are right, after all? I don't know. It's in my little box where I throw slips of paper about "Things I Don't Understand." Maybe that's as far as we're supposed to get with troubling issues, just having the faith to turn them over & wait for an answer that may or may not come in this lifetime. I personally don't think it's fair that IMPATIENT IRISH PEOPLE LIKE ME have to wait, but hey, that's just my opinion..... So I do understand your frustration, Pyro. What do we do if two equally good-hearted & sincere people pray about the same question, ask for some "sign" & both think they receive a sign? Or neither does? It's the old "Now I see through a glass darkly....."
Well, this has been too long & no doubt totally confusing but I hope you hear what I'm saying. Frustration duly noted & agreed with--but I guess somewhere in all this "Hurry up & wait" mess, there's a lesson for each of us.....Did any of that make sense? Help, Rose! Help, Carol!

LOL!!!!
((((((((((((((((((DOC)))))))))))))))))))))))

That's it? That's your help???? LOL!!!! GREAT!!!

((((Rose)))))

Ahhhh Doc you want help>>help is here what can i say having looked through the posts it is an age old argument God gives us signs everyday he talks to us continually WE have to listen as for interpretation there have been so many interpretations over the years of various scriptures and sooo may arguments people are still killing each other because of it and yet all it really takes is to listen to your own convictions and pray about it and ask God to help you to understand and feel comfortable with the understanding you reach,the Holy Spirit was sent for that purpose to convict us and make us aware when we are going astray or out of Gods will>>stay under the Umbrella and you wont get wet.
I dont know if that makes any sense it does to me but then it would i am a bit odd you all know that.
Hope it helps.

"Stay under God's umbrella and you won't get wet?" Only you, Kimmie......LOL! Good point, though. The Holy Spirit is supposed to help us figure some of these things out, right?

quote:

Originally posted by DewDoc:
"Things I Don't Understand." Maybe that's as far as we're supposed to get with troubling issues, just having the faith to turn them over & wait for an answer that may or may not come in this lifetime. I personally don't think it's fair that IMPATIENT IRISH PEOPLE LIKE ME have to wait, but hey, that's just my opinion.....

I completely agree about it not being fair. Impatient people don't have time to wait.
I'm pretty sure that's Biblical.. somewhere along the lines of, "An idle hand is the devil's workshop."

I like that Pyro its a very good reason for not being patient.We wouldnt want to be idle now would we lol.
I was thinking tho quite often when I have been concerned about something and praying for wisdom or guidance and to-ing and fro-ing with a thought >>somebody in my circle will suddenly say something or do something which will confirm one way or another what I was wavering on,I do beleive God works this way through people to help us when we are so bizzzy dithering we cant hear him clearly.
Also doctrin is such a huge issue always has been and probably always will be so we just have to agree to differ with some Churches/people etc on various issues Motive I feel is what Gods measure would be on that one, is our motive good and pure and selfless or are we wanting to justify some bad behaviours if the motive is good the interpretations unclear confusing or just differing I beleive God honours his word in that we are all his children and as long as we are seeking his will he will make sure we are taken care of and eventually placed on the right path.
People are notoriously fearful creatures and so those within the confines of the conventional Church will often make a stance based on an interpretation for fear of one or two things firstly they certainly dont want to be wrong and possibly lead a brother/sister down the wrong path and therefore feel responsible for their possible condemnation,and also many people are fearful of change and progress,How many older people do we all know who were full of mistrust when we first heard about the computer and the wonderful things it can do >>I was adamant I would never ever have one in my home they were the mark of the devil and the first step towards admitting 666 into our lives.
LOL look at me the computer saved my sanity when it lead me to this site and these boards to say nothing of the friendship and love it has brought me.
Now many people feel that way about the scriptures "That is what it says and that is what it means and dont tell us otherwise because we are scared of change ok?"But we man has changed the meanings and misinterpreted scriptures since we could read >>firstly language is very very hard to translate in the absolute ,we all know about the differing kinds of love ie Agape dont we Doc,so it is with many words and phrases,I will always let my spirit be my guide it knows when it is at peace and we all have to seek that place within ourselves to honour God,
i know I know I am warbling on and liking the sound of my own voice but i like these debates and I would really love to help anybody find the route that they can live with.
One of my dearest friends is a our ex Ministers wife,we have such a wonderful friendship and she has been there thro thick and thin >>BUT she wasnt happy re the gay issue told me so and that she loved me anyway and we left it at that.
A couple of months ago we were talking and she said something about the whole gay issue and how the Church had not behaved its self very well over it at all, similar words to that you get the gist. but I never in a million years thought i would hear her say the Church just might be wrong or mislead etc.
Unfortunatly patience is our weakness and God will teach everyone eventually.
In the meantime hang in there lets get some prayer beads out for Will and others in his situation and keep praying for the truth to set us all free.

The young man had lost his job and didn't know which way to turn. So he went to see the old preacher.

Pacing about the preacher's study, the young man ranted about his problem. Finally he clenched his fist and shouted, "I've begged God to say something to help me. Tell me, Preacher, why doesn't God answer?"

The old preacher, who sat across the room, spoke something in reply -- something so hushed it was indistinguishable. The young man stepped across the room. "What did you say?" he asked.

The preacher repeated himself, but again in a tone as soft as a whisper. So the young man moved closer until he was leaning on the preacher's chair. "Sorry," he said. "I still didn't hear you."

With their heads bent together, the old preacher spoke once more. "God sometimes whispers," he said, "so we will move closer to hear Him."

This time the young man heard and he understood.

We all want God's voice to thunder through the air with the answer to our problem. But God's is the still, small voice. . .the gentle whisper.

Perhaps there's a reason. Nothing draws human focus quite like a whisper. God's whisper means I must stop my ranting and move close to Him, until my head is bent together with His. And then, as I listen, I will find my answer. Better still, I find myself closer to God.

Rose my Dear, I think perhaps you may have just nailed this one. Well done!

God is Great!!!
I'm with you in Prayer Pyro!

Hi everyone. I haven't posted in a long time, but came on tonight and just read this thread. How interesting that everyone is looking for a sign. Do we ever really know if we've been given a sign? After all, we only receive from God what is His will and always in His time. Why must it always be a mystery? Why doesn't God be more direct? He can give us all the signs we need, but in the end we use the free will He has given us. And because so much feels like a mystery, one can only hope one has read the sign the way it was intended. I guess this is where FAITH comes into play. Does this make any sense to anyone?

It makes total sense!!!

Now Faith IS the "Substance" of things Hoped for, the "Evidence" of things NOT SEEN.